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What makes Fallout 4 crash?

Here's a follow up on the errors where I finally isolated the 'overrun' problem- where another user had the same problem and did the legwork for us. I did use the previous version of Mutant Menegerie along with the newest Life Finds a Way(both caused the same problem when using the newest version of The Marshlands). I've had a previous version of The Marshlands and the previous version of Mutant Menegerie and both worked just fine.

Back to the keyboard... and beyond!
 
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Interesting. I kicked Life Finds a Way out of my LO exactly because of those issues
 
JM91 said:
Interesting. I kicked Life Finds a Way out of my LO exactly because of those issues
Click to expand...
Yeah that one threw me for a loop. I think it's the newest version of Marshlands, not so much MMLFaW. In the past I had both Marshlands and Mutant Menegerie in my load order and they worked just fine together without crashing, then I remember downloading quite a few updates for The Marshlands- after that, the problem started. At least for me.
 
Weird. I never had Marshlands, but as soon as I switched from the modular Menageries (Safari, Backwater Beasts, Horrors of the Fog) to Life finds a way, I got a hard CTD everytime I loaded into a save
 
Here's a snapshot of a game save from around May of this year. These are plugins that are required by the game save as compared to my currently 'live!' load order. I've highlighted "The Marshlands" and you can see the legacy Mutant Menegerie just below it. Those aren't present any more currently so it reports them as missing- but back then they were installed- it's a function of being able to 'restore' a previous game save using previously used plugins.

That's what threw me for a loop awhile back. Everything worked just fine, and I switched legacy Mutant Menegerie to the Life Finds A Way. I'll have to go by memory on this one since the application's manifest wasn't completely coded when I was installing mods back then, but I'm pretty sure that worked ok. Then, as I was keeping my mod library 'up to date', I'd downloaded and updated The Marshlands, at least, three times. This is what's leading me to believe it's that- though it could be a LFaW update that couldv'e also caused it.
 

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Apparently Stamper has said that any update to LFaW requires a new game. Not sure if folks switched between legacy MM and LFaW mid-game, but I assume it would bust your save just because everything about it is different and the forms aren't even the same in many cases.
 
Captain LaserBeam said:
Apparently Stamper has said that any update to LFaW requires a new game. Not sure if folks switched between legacy MM and LFaW mid-game, but I assume it would bust your save just because everything about it is different and the forms aren't even the same in many cases.
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This was causing a CTD with new games- I was adding back in mods and starting a new game each time trying to find the source of the problem. With my current game, I have MM LFaW from the start of the playthrough, but left disabled:

TheWilderness
TheFarmlands
TheMarshlands
TheForest

though the were still installed. I, mid game, re-activated TheWilderness, TheFarmlands and TheForest without a problem, but re-activating TheMarshlands caused a CTD with STACK_OVERRUN and an incomplete Buffout 4 log being generated each time; and happens whether it's a new game or one in progress.
Let's me try a quick test using an older version of The Marshlands real quick and check the results. Give me a few minutes...
 
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Ok, rolling back to v1.2 of TheMarshlands causes the same CTD when activated. Let me download and rollback again...
 
Rolled back to v1.0 of TheMarshlands- same crash. Give me just a bit to do a bit more research and I'll post back...
 
Captain LaserBeam said:
Apparently Stamper has said that any update to LFaW requires a new game. Not sure if folks switched between legacy MM and LFaW mid-game, but I assume it would bust your save just because everything about it is different and the forms aren't even the same in many cases.
Click to expand...
For me it was a new game since it's completely different from it's legacy version. I'm wondering if it's related to the injection scripts somehow since that's one major difference between MM legacy and LFaW.
 
So, a very belated update/discovery I made. Even after several new games with a more reduced loadorder (from around 900 plugins/600 mods to now 419 mods/with 400 plugins, and still eventually getting the dreaded CTD (mostly I'd do the Sanctuary quests, start 2-3 settlements with very light plans, the basic plans from the WG pack, playtime of 3-10 hours), I started another game without any of the SS mods and the random crashes are yet to occur. Which sucks, since SS is my favourite mod for FO4.
I've downloaded the all-in-one version of SS and I'll try to add as few addons as possible, maybe this way I can make it work
 
JM91 said:
So, a very belated update/discovery I made. Even after several new games with a more reduced loadorder (from around 900 plugins/600 mods to now 419 mods/with 400 plugins, and still eventually getting the dreaded CTD (mostly I'd do the Sanctuary quests, start 2-3 settlements with very light plans, the basic plans from the WG pack, playtime of 3-10 hours), I started another game without any of the SS mods and the random crashes are yet to occur. Which sucks, since SS is my favourite mod for FO4.
I've downloaded the all-in-one version of SS and I'll try to add as few addons as possible, maybe this way I can make it work
Click to expand...
I wonder if that's somehow related to dynamically 'modifying' existing cells. Here's something I'm trying atm- I installed the latest version of BNS 3.0, replacing the beta version. Hopefully, that'll change the crash 'metrics' enough to help isolate some causailies.I don't have SS2 installed atm since I'm more interested in just the settlers building their own settlements, rather than the storyline(at least for now).
 
Same here, I like having a little green in my game, the vanilla look is a little too drab for me. But that tool is mighty useful. I'm just disabling mods and then dump 3h+ into a new game, in order to check for crashes :grin
I had suspected SS to be the culprit for a while, since it is very script heavy and causes my savefiles to ballon in file size.
But I'd be very interested in any progress you make, regarding the issue.
In addition, in feedback to your tool, I can follow and understand everything you say or show, but I don't think I can you useful help regarding new features, my expertise in "coding" starts and stops with Excel and Notepad++
I do apreciate the time and effort you put into explaining and showing everything, don't get me wrong
 
JM91 said:
Same here, I like having a little green in my game, the vanilla look is a little too drab for me. But that tool is mighty useful. I'm just disabling mods and then dump 3h+ into a new game, in order to check for crashes :grin
I had suspected SS to be the culprit for a while, since it is very script heavy and causes my savefiles to ballon in file size.
But I'd be very interested in any progress you make, regarding the issue.
In addition, in feedback to your tool, I can follow and understand everything you say or show, but I don't think I can you useful help regarding new features, my expertise in "coding" starts and stops with Excel and Notepad++
I do apreciate the time and effort you put into explaining and showing everything, don't get me wrong
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Your very welcome. It's not so much the coding, but if you have any ideas on a 'process' that would help debug a 'load out' just toss it my way and I'll see what I can do to translate that into code.
 
That's interesting. I've encountered the exact same bug with Ketaros. If I remember correctly, there are two versions of his framework, one that places the items in the world (which I use as well) and one that adds them to loot containers. What is a stack anyways? Stack of scripts?
In my current run, I've just enabled SS and some other mods (like Ketaros), so far I'm still crash free and no suspended stacks in my save, "only" 60 unattached instances
 
JM91 said:
That's interesting. I've encountered the exact same bug with Ketaros. If I remember correctly, there are two versions of his framework, one that places the items in the world (which I use as well) and one that adds them to loot containers.
Click to expand...
There's Ketaros World and Ketaros Framework- I used to use KW but switched to KF. I'm thinking it's a null reference somewhere in the magazine data(the 'form') somewhere that links it back to 'something'. I can see it, just not interact with it- can't pick it up or click on it while in the 'console' like I can other magazines or cards.
JM91 said:
What is a stack anyways? Stack of scripts?
Click to expand...
It's this. I know it might be confusing but a frame is a small piece of a script that's being executed.
 
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