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Old Post Recreating Mod Functionality: Snap Beds (and other mods)

C B Wright

Active Member
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246
The builders kit has

so.

freaking.

much.

in it, and I'm trying to determine if I can "make do" with using just it and the DLCs when building, with an eye on making leveled settlements that people can download without having to add my standard building mods, which I love and am loath to part with. But I'm doing it! I'm doing it for Sim Settlements! It may all end in tears, but I'm giving it a try.

So the first mod I'm trying to substitute is Snap Beds.

Snap Beds is a pretty simple mod, but it's great. Basically you have bed frame pieces and mattress pieces. Bed frames snap to each other, and mattress pieces snap in the frames. It's the mattress pieces that count as "beds", so you can (for example) take a bunk bed frame and snap two mattresses in it, and not only does it count as two beds, but settlers will actually sleep on both mattresses. Similarly, you can use "mattress halves" and place them in a double-bed frame. Each half counts as a full bed, and settlers can sleep on both.

It can make some interesting bed pieces -- take a small bed frame and a large mattress, put them together, and you have a weird bed with metal bits poking out the head and feet. But it's neat enough that I still use them in settlements, even with Sim Settlements making most of the housing for me.

So! Can the toolkit replace Snap Beds?

Well, eventually, for the multi-bed part. It won't do the snapping, and it won't do the "bed component" swapping, but it has the tools you need to create two beds out of a single model. It has these little blue holograms of sleeping people that can act as bed assignments -- one for the ground, and one for surfaces. So you could, for example, take a bunk bed piece and put a sleeping hologram on each mattress, and voila -- two assignable beds. Same for a double bed, just put one on each side.

Right this second it looks like there's a bug where the assignable item in the kit is accidentally linked to the non-assignable version. So that will need to be fixed first.

The only downside is that at the moment there aren't a lot of non-assignable bed pieces. That would be a nice feature request -- have the "two person" (bunk and double) beds come in non-assignable models, so you can add the holograms as needed.

Something I'm particularly excited about with this feature is that if you're feeling really meticulous about it, it looks like you could use the same hologram on different surfaces across city levels. So you could have whoever is assigned to it sleeping on a sleeping bag when the city is level 0, change to a dirty cot at level 1, a clean cot at level 2, and something with actual covers and a pillow at level 3 -- assuming you can find non-assignable bed models to use it with, of course. You just replace the bed surface with each level, while keeping the hologram intact. That's the theory, anyway. When the hologram gets fixed I'll test it with my Sanctuary build...
 
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Next on the list: Snap'n'Build 2.0

This one hurts a little. Snap'n'Build has been one of my go-to kits since I started seriously trying to build things. It has five basic "sets" that you can use:

- A domestic house building set, with different marbelized walls, stairways, rails, stone foundations, roofs, and windows
- A bunker set, with various concrete structures and pieces
- A greenhouse set, with different sized foundations and various glass walls and roofs
- A "trailer" set, which allows you to use the aluminum trailer you pieces you find in (for example) Fiddler's Green.
- An industrial set which gives you access to all the corvega walkways and those nifty blue metal structures.

It also has, as a subset to the house building set, a number of extra wood pieces -- clean half-walls, door frames with insets for glass, wood, and metal windows, and wood and metal wall pieces with more modern-looking windows.

So how well does the city builder kit replace this? Well, I might be looking in all the wrong places, but it looks like it doesn't really. Here's how each set stacks up:

Bunker set. The bunker set is something I haven't used in a long time. Roughly 90% of what it offers that I would use is covered in the Workshop DLC. The city builder kit provides a bunch of concrete stuff, but it's mostly along the lines of cracked/broken concrete -- good for builds where you are showing settlers adapting existing structures and turning it into something else, but I find it narratively strange to think of settlers dragging a broken down concrete building across the bridge into sanctuary, then setting it down on a 2x2 foundation to start building their new home. Sometimes it's best not to look too closely at the implications behind that kind of stuff. :)

Anyway, the loss of the bunker set is mostly mitigated by the Workshop DLC, but if you aren't using the DLCs that won't help you. I guess I need to make a note at the top of the first post to make clear I'm evaluating this from the perspective of someone who has all DLCs installed, except for the hi-res texture one.

Greenhouse set. I used this one a lot before the Contraptions DLC, but other than the walls being higher in the Contraptions set pieces they are mostly identical. If you want to build build a greenhouse, just build a warehouse with all window pieces.

The city builder kit also has some greenhouse pieces. There were fewer than I expected, but I noticed a few times that the workshop menus have been faking me out -- I would think I'd reached the end of a list only to find that no, it was just loading more pieces. So I'll need to revisit that.

But for the most part, the Contraptions DLC will do everything you would use the Greenhouse set for, except for one thing: The greenhouse set has a 1x2 stone foundation piece, which was something I never knew I needed until I discovered I had it, and now I don't understand why that isn't a thing.

Trailer set. There's nothing like this in vanilla Workshop, and so far I haven't found any trailer pieces in the builder's kit. But something tells me I should keep looking, because it's one of the default settlement plots.

I used this any time I wanted to show semi-permanent dwellings. I liked the way the mod author had set this up, because the trailers were snappable with each other, making them podlike, and there were connecting mini-pods and snappable interior walls that were available as well. Of course, you don't need to snap anything together if you have Place Anywhere, but using the snap points are faster.

I gotta believe there's at least one metal trailer thing hanging around in the builder's kit somewhere, but I haven't found it yet.

House set. What's funny about this set is I hardly ever used the main part, where you could build the fancy-looking houses, but I used specific components from this set more than anything else in any part of the game:
  • First, the foundations. There were five or six different types of stone foundations. They came in 2x2 and 1x1 shapes, both as squares and as triangles. The foundations were unique in that they could stack on top of themselves, meaning you could make very tall stone walls. You could snap different floors on top of it, but until you put a floor on it, objects would clip through it (you could still walk on them though). These things were amazing and I am feeling the loss of them most keenly. There is no real alternative to them, I'm just having to learn to do without.
  • Second, the shack walls, doors, roofs, and windows. The basic house pieces were too fancy for my taste, but the mod author made equivalent wood and metal pieces in a "shack" menu that looked more stylistically like the default Workshop metal and wood pieces, only cleaner. Essentially it's the step up a settler would take after they actually got the hang of carpentry. The glass windows added a lot to the look of an otherwise simple rectangle, and I found I was starting to use them a lot with SS interior residential plots. There are no vanilla equivalents to these, but the city kit does have a few pieces that I've been able to use in its place. There aren't nearly as many window options.
All in all I miss the house set, and I now have to re-think my basic designs for apartment complexes.

Industrial Set. Basically there is no replacement for this. The city kit does have some catwalk pieces, but the corvega industrial catwalks, stairs, and rooms all had a very distinctive, rugged style that there's really no substitute for aesthetically. But because the look is so distinct it's not the kind of thing you can just drop everywhere, so I suppose I'll just have to learn to do without.

Summary: the city builder kit doesn't really cover the kinds of stuff the snap'n'build was doing, visually. If you have the DLCs, you can cover for most of the bunker and greenhouse stuff. The city builder kit has stuff that can be used in place off some of the things in the house set, though it's not a 1 for 1 switch. It looks like there's no analog for the trailer and industrial sets.
 
Great post I'm also trying to build with out my go building mods. Those where master plan mods and work shop rearanged. Also I threw in some g2m and thematic and practical. I have yet to find the defense replacement in the new builders kit. And the junk car walls where my go to for a nice immersive defense wall. I I'm going to have to figure something out. Maybe if the kit added just the car models I could build my own. Over all this kit make up with what missing by added a ton of new features that I haven't seen in building mods before.
 
Huh? Junk cars are in there... All the junk cars.
Careful with them, vanilla collision is annoying.

Decorations->Vehicles I believe
You also get planes and trains.

As for other stuff, your mileage is going to vary... a lot... I know capsules are coming per request but don't have an ETA. We don't have anything like custom assets from thematic and practical. The greenhouse and warehouse sets in our tool are used with permission from Ethreon.

Snap and build sets are something you're going to need to probably just break down and create a dependency for. The Snap and Build and Snappy Housekits sets are mostly made of SCOL objects containing multiple parts of things that don't have 3d in the CK.

To use those assets, you would need to include them with your theme pack if you didn't want to create a dependency. This requires permission from the mod author to use their assets.
 
Snap'n'build may be one of the ones I find too useful to live without, but I'm trying to do this sanctuary build without, just to see what I keep running up against.
 
Thank you for the pointers will definitely look in decorations for the cars. Was there defensive guard posts in the kit. I'm away from my computer right now but I've kinda thought there was. Or was it the guard markers I can't remember. Hopefully if the markers are there I'll be able to put together my own design. Really trying to get a city plan with out using any other dependences.
 
Don't forget all the extra junk fences under Structure->Fences

Double high junk fences, and fence towers?

You could make a junk castle out of that if you were so inclined.
 
Thank you for the pointers will definitely look in decorations for the cars. Was there defensive guard posts in the kit. I'm away from my computer right now but I've kinda thought there was. Or was it the guard markers I can't remember. Hopefully if the markers are there I'll be able to put together my own design. Really trying to get a city plan with out using any other dependences.

Yes
Special->Assignables I think.
 
Next up: Homemaker

Hoo, boy. Homemaker. This is one of the granddaddy's of all building mods. It's been around forever, and while I moved away from a lot of it over time, it still has pieces that I go to again and again.

Homemaker and the city builder's kit are both huge (though I think the city kit is probably bigger) and they definitely overlap. The difference is that Homemaker is built to allow your character to build specific new things in-game in a "lore-friendly" manner. There are items that are gated by in-game achievements, skills, everything has material costs... meanwhile, the builder's kit is designed to allow you to build things for an entirely different game. It's not lore-friendly, it's meta friendly -- you put a bunch of stuff together to come up with a Thing. That's why pretty much everything costs one wood, and why you can simulate working fusion reactors without having to have four ranks of science.

So can the city builder's kit replace Homemaker? The answer to that question depends on what you're trying to do. If you want your character to build a settlement then you want to use Homemaker. Otherwise, the city builder toolkit can do pretty much everything Homemaker can do.

It's not a 1 for 1 replacement. There are things in Homemaker not in the kit, and vice-versa, but for everything you don't find you find plenty of other options to mess with. The only thing I noticed that I specifically miss were some of the generator models. The generators in the kit are dummies, so they don't do anything other than look pretty (I just set them over the power-generating power connector thingies, and voila--instant generator) but Homemaker has a few that kit doesn't, like the squat yellow stubby things and the really big non-fusion one. On the other hand, the city builder's kit has those freaking reactor models that are amazing.

So yeah... trade-off. But for the purpose of building settlements that minimize the extra downloads you can absolutely use the city kit in place of Homemaker.
 
Do It Yourshelf

Can the city kit replace Do It Yourshelf? Yes. But... no. But, at the end of the day... yes.

There are mods that give you access to content you wouldn't already have, then there are mods that make that content easier for you to use. Do It Yourshelf, for me, is an example of the latter. The thing I suck at, when it comes to building, is dealing with clutter. I really like the structures I design, but I'm not good at making them look lived in. The arrangement of clutter in Sim Settlements is amazing and it makes me jealous. I don't have a head for it, and the more I think about it the more tired I get.

Enter Do It Yourshelf.

DIY gives you two things: a bunch of shelves that have snappable shelf space, and a bunch of decorative clutter than can snap into those shelves. Put together, these are awesome. There are lots of different kinds of clutter: piles of weapons, ammo, chems, food, medicine, knicknacks... and you can put them on shelves to make it look like hey, people live here and they have things. It comes with refrigerators, and you can snap food and chems in there to make it look like hey, people live here and they have electricity and they don't want food to spoil.

And finally, there's nothing stopping you from just taking some of the clutter and plopping it down on a non-snapping surface.

Do It Yourshelf is a crutch in the very best sense of the word, in that it allows me to quickly drop some "people live here" stuff in rooms without having to agonize through a process I'm pretty bad at, all things considered.

The city kit actually has an entire section devoted to clutter. It's not snapping clutter, though I find the more I use place anywhere the less I really care about that (seriously, the ability to highlight and nudge makes snapping important really only when I'm building structures, and even then the snap points are more like "general guidelines" -- JUST LIKE THE PIRATE CODE).

So hey -- the city kit can replace Do It Yourshelf!

Except... that city kit clutter doesn't appear to be bundled quite as well as Do It Yourself. Which means your clutter work becomes more like a mini-building session of it's own... which, as I've already noted, I'm terrible at where clutter is concerned, while DIY just let's me pick "weapons 5 and ammo 2, drop on the table, BOOM" and I'm done. So... DIY is definitely easier to use, which is the entire point of the mod to begin with.

Still, you can create clutter just fine with the city kit, so at the end of the day, yes, you can do without. It's just that for some of us it will be... more painful than it will be for others.

And if you listen very closely, off in the distance you will hear me screaming at the game while I try to figure out what !@#$% clutter to put in my settlements...
 
Creative Clutter

Creative Clutter, like Do It Yourshelf, gives you set pieces that looked "lived in." The difference is that instead of giving you empty shelves and blocks of clutter to use, its focus is on furniture that has stuff on it.

Creative Clutter has lots of really cool furniture, and the furniture has Stuff on it. Tables have food, cups, games, towels piled on it. The nightstand has a clock. Or... er... handcuffs, depending on your proclivities. Hey, I'm not here to judge. Unless you're a Gunner, then I probably am.

This clutter goes beyond just furniture. It has cluttered crafting tables. It also has miniature crafting tables that snap onto surfaces -- and is compatible with Do It Yourshelf, to boot! it also has snappable plants that generate food.

Creative Clutter and Do It Yourshelf were what I used, pretty much exclusively, when I wanted to decorate my interiors. Of the two, giving up Creative Clutter has been more painful, because it has a few specific set pieces that have no real mirror on the city kit side. Specifically I'm thinking of the cluttered crafting tables and the mini crafting tables. Being able to plop down a little chem station on a small table next to a computer, and have both the computer and the chem table work -- CC is the only thing I can find to make that happen. (Trying to put a computer on the l-shaped chem station is a little harder to pull off, because it's really easy to click on the wrong thing and start crafting when you want to load a holotape).

The plant-growing thing is also very cool, and I miss it. At some point in the game, after it's advanced to a certain point, I always choose one settlement where I create a research lab that specifically grows the little glowy green mushrooms... because I figure eventually a civilization is going to figure out they really need to have the ability to make antibiotics in bulk. Before CC I had to use Vault 88 and have settlers farm green mushrooms.

Still, I don't need it. I mean, I haven't actually unloaded it from my mod list while I'm building, because I'm not a savage, but I haven't actually used it yet either. Most of the stuff I'd want to use it for would be in a post-level 3 city world anyway, so once I finish up Sanctuary I'll use it to "season to taste." But I don't need it.

Not having access to those beautiful cluttered workbenches, though... That hurts.
 
Creative Clutter

Creative Clutter, like Do It Yourshelf, gives you set pieces that looked "lived in." The difference is that instead of giving you empty shelves and blocks of clutter to use, its focus is on furniture that has stuff on it.
Yeah, I decided that I'm not going to give them up, and used them both extensively in my city plan. May I direct your attention to Thematic and Practical for that wonderfully scrappy look, and Kraggles Structures for large scale teraforming.
 
I have Kraggles, it's on my list!
When I decided to do a build without a scrap mod, it was *very* handing in making unwanted bushes "disappear" and making nice plot size sections. It's wonderful.
 
Next up: Homemaker
...

It's not a 1 for 1 replacement. There are things in Homemaker not in the kit, and vice-versa, but for everything you don't find you find plenty of other options to mess with. The only thing I noticed that I specifically miss were some of the generator models. The generators in the kit are dummies, so they don't do anything other than look pretty (I just set them over the power-generating power connector thingies, and voila--instant generator) but Homemaker has a few that kit doesn't, like the squat yellow stubby things and the really big non-fusion one. On the other hand, the city builder's kit has those freaking reactor models that are amazing.

check industrial decorations. machines has all the squat yellow things i believe and it goes large.
 
Do It Yourshelf

Can the city kit replace Do It Yourshelf? Yes. But... no. But, at the end of the day... Yes

DIY and the rest of the creative clutter is complementary to the clutter in the tool to the point where someday maybe kg will say damn the filesizes, full speed ahead and give us the creative clutter community resources as part of the tool.
 
In addition to the stuff already said. the pieces in the tool were laid out by a small team of mostly 2 maniacs who didnt always come up with a consistent menu structure. There are multiple 1x2 pieces in the building kits section of the tool under structures with multiple materials.

KG has personally done a ton of work reorganizing this back into sanity but some work remains.
 
Is a reorg of the menu in the works? I started documentation on the current layout but if it's going to change I'll hold off.
 
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