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Question WS+ activation button.

SailorM24

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98
I did mention this in another thread but since I am still having issues I thought I would start a thread.
I assume all the other issues I am having, like none of the settlers assigning correctly or using the assignment caps is due to this issue.
I had left the game sit for sometime and opened last night to see an update hoping this would have been resolved. It is still there however.
If I open the WS+ holotape and go to the activation section and try and turn the buttons off they do not change. I have tried multiple things to try and over come it. The strongest was to disable WS advance the save then enable WS+ again and it behaves the same. The buttons do not seem to be working, I can not turn off the feature.
With the feature running all sorts of things get messed up mainly because only one mod can use that button, but aside from that with the feature running all assignments seem to get messed up.
One example is crops, I have the cap set at 12 per settler. If I plant a new crop it auto assigns to one of the settlers that already has 12 crops. The poor kid down at Warwick currently has 55 crops in his care but the mother will not auto assign and can't be manually assigned because she has no command feature. There are many other issue but I am guessing they are all related to that button and not being able to turn the feature off.
I am not sure if I am alone in this, so I am just looking for some feedback, has anyone on Xbox been able to turn this feature off via the buttons in the holotape?
 
Just to keep this updated. I have not been playing the game, but have been keeping an eye out for mod updates, hoping this issue will resolve itself. When I saw the Framework update I decided to test and see if there was anything in ths update that might help this issue.
After running around to some affected settlements they are the same as they were and the buttons for activation still stay on. I did not really expect that a framework update would fix my issue in WS+, but one can dream.
I want to repeat something I said before and try to express the importance in this for updates.
Xbox users can't go and load a previous version of the mod, once you update that is it. If the update broke the game, your game is broken until an update is given again.
In my mind the simplest solution is any new added feature that is a switch to turn things on and off, should come off/vanilla by default, until the user switches it on. If that was the case in this situation, then when I turned the activation buttons on and found things not working correctly, I could have simply gone back a save or two and restored my game. That is the only tool Xbox users have, revert to an earlier save.
 
I have done a little more on this so this is just and also note. I tried disabling WS+. My hope was that the assignment system would go back to normal and then I could disable WS+ manage settlements and then re enable to build settlements. The game is not playable now, I fear how much damage I might do in the settlements if I continue to save with assignments as they are.
No luck disabling WS+ removed the option button conflict but the assignment system remained broken. If I loaded a save made prior to the update the system did not appear broken, but I am not sure it was 100%. I have been playing with these mods so long I forget what the game plays like without them.
 
Reading this - I’m not certain if you’re meaning WS+ or WSFW. WS+ affects building mode, WSFW affects settler assignments.

If you disabled WSFW even temporarily then your game is broken from that point onwards. The workshop scripts have become basically mixed up.

Regarding WS+, I’m not sure what’s up. I am a PC user - I don’t have experience with XBox.

I am curious what happens with a fresh game. Just a temporary throwaway one. Are things still messed up?
 
I only turned off WS+ as a test. I don't turn off mods and continue the save and expect my game will not be broken.
I did that test to try and show two things.
I have dumped this exact LO into a vanilla save that never had mods and the issue remained with one settler auto assigning to any new crop planted. I stopped adding new crops once that settler was handling more than the max that could even be assigned to them in WSFW, 30 IIRC. The setting was 12 for crops and I went far enough to see if a new settler would start taking up the new crops but that did not happen.
The test to disable WS+ was mainly to confirm that the activation in WS+ was affecting WSFW in a negative manner.
Originally I posted this in a WSFW thread where people were having similar problems, but they could turn the WS+ feature off because the control button works. The WS+ buttons have not worked in any test I have run, they stay on no matter what I do.
That was the second part of this recent test to see if disabling WS+, advancing the save, then re-enabling it might make the button work, but it did not.
There was another underlying point, on the dangers for Xbox users when any feature is auto enabled, because we can't revert to an earlier version of any mod. If we turn them on then we can go back a save and restore our games.
The only test that did have an effect on the assignment issue was to disable WS+ then open a save before both WSFW and WS+ were updated. That save would not have the updated WS+ data in it. When I open that early save the assignment issue does not happen. Assignments were as they were, but there were some other issues, but they were likely having to do with continuing the save without WS+, I expected to see some issues from continuing a save with a removed mod. I did not run a test on the vanilla save without WS+ active but I will now because there might be a bearing. It would also be clearer, if I then activate WS+ and the assignments go screwy again that will be a form of confirmation.
Unfortunately that is about all we can do on Xbox half baked tests, it is very difficult because we have little control.

This test was not conclusive but sort of shows that the cause of the issue is something that WS+ did with the activation and it impacted WSFW in a negative manner.
 
@Whisper
Thanks I did find the fault, for the most part anyways.
I hope I explain this correctly because it was a mind bender to figure out. The punch line is the update appears to ignore what is already planted and assigned. I opened a vanilla save that had settlements already running and I did not install WS+. When I added new crops the settlers would auto assign to those crops even though they were already at there max amount. This time they stopped taking on new crops when they reached the assignment value then the next settler would pick up where they left off.
If the settlement had 5 farmers and and 30 crops, with a limit of 6 each the settlers would take on 6 more each until they each had 12, 6 previously assigned and 6 new. It took some time to figure that out because all you really see is the crops being added and the settlers taking them up. It does not explain what is going on in my game but at least I know I can start a new one.
I also found that if I stored all the existing crops and brought crops down to zero I could plant new and assign as normal.
Then I added WS+ to look for changes.
First I started on the settlements that I had already sorted out. If I planted a new crop it did not auto assign, but that did not prevent me from assigning it and adding to the farms total crops. First I planted one mutfruit and selected a settler and assigned them to it and their total would jump to 7 and the farm total would go up one. I could repeat this until the game decided to take that settlers count down to 0 and reassign them the whole of the job. Then it would auto assign them but it did not stop them at 6 it stopped them at the amount they had before. In most cases this reset would happen at 8 or 9, so they would go back to that number, but would not have added 1. So assignments still were not working correctly but were manageable.
The button to turn off activation still did not work so I could not see if that was affecting anything. It was just on, no off.
Next I opened the same save I started with but with WS+ active and got the same results as before where things just auto assign endlessly. I was trying to see if it had something to do with the crops already in place, but it does not seem to, nor could I identify anything to test. It would seem that if both mods are installed at the same time something very strange goes on.
Armed with what I had learned I went back to my current game. I tried with WS+ disabled and there was no difference everything auto assigns if I plant it. Then I tried with WS+ enabled and got the same results. Next I tried storing all crops and starting the farm again. In this game each settler handles 12 crops. All I could ever get was one settler assigned to crops because they took the assignment for every crop planted. Next I tried Warwick where the strangest things were happening. Once I scrapped everything neither the mother nor the son would pickup any crop, both cannot be command so I could not force the assignment and neither are auto assigning.
I suspect the issue might have been created by scripts running in the wrong order or something like that. Prior to the last few updates the xbox was already having script issues. If you turned in a quest at a settlement it would take 5 mins for the log to update. Larger quests longer. It took 15 minutes for me to get the marker on the teleport machine after triggering the quest with Sturges. On Beth net X-mod users were reporting 10 minute waits for the crops to appear fruited. Unfortunately that is one of our tools for determining script lag.
It is not likely to happen but it would be nice if the Xbox version was rolled back to an earlier version at or near the time when the time of the settler change that prevented some settler mods from working. That is the last time it ran smoothly, the poor Xbox does not have a lot of power.
 
It sounds somewhat like an issue that @kinggath had (I thought) fixed. Perhaps it is something related.

(Apologies for tagging you - I know you are super-super busy right now. :( )
 
It could just be an Xbox issue. I really don't want to give up the combo, mainly because of the flight in build feature. I do a lot of testing for other mod authors, and with that feature I can access under the center cell and trap objects that should not be transferred to the center cell. This helps the settlement mods. All testing on Xbox has to be creative since we don't have access to anything. All the other load order regulars on Beth net have stopped testing these mods for one reason or another.
I use max threads constantly and even leave the game idle so I manage the script load and until this I really had only seen lag.
I might just start a new game and see how it goes, but Beth has broken downtown on Xbox, so playing this game is not a high priority currently. If I do and notice anything different I will reply to this thread, for information. That said I had run out of ideas, but your suggestion and my last test have given me some ideas. If I do start a new game I will not install WS+ until later to see if I can see any differences.
 
Holotape is fixed for next build. If there was more to this thread than that, bug-wise, please tag me - as Whisper mentioned I'm a little overwhelmed right now so just skimmed!
 
Holotape is fixed for next build. If there was more to this thread than that, bug-wise, please tag me - as Whisper mentioned I'm a little overwhelmed right now so just skimmed!
It has been a while since I booted the game as it is broken on Xbox thanks to Beth. I did load the updates a couple of weeks ago and since have tried some things on different saves. The results are consitant across all saves.
The switches sort of work but not really.
You only can change one of the now two switches once. If you turn one off you can not turn it back on. Nor can you then turn the other off.
If you open the pipboy and switch either the item button or settler button the holotape shows the other as off. Turn settlers off and the holotape says it is on, but the item button will show it as off. When you exit and go in game the switch you turned off is clearly off, but the other remains on even though the holotape says it is off. If you go back into the holotape you will get no action on either choice once either has been activated once.
Some improvement but it is still not working as you intended.
Thanks for trying to get this fixed and sorry I am taking too much time replying, but the state of the game on Xbox is not good. Beth says they have a fix and it will be ready for the holidays. I will be faster replying when they make the game playable again.
 
If there was more to this thread than that, bug-wise, please tag me
All of the assignment issues that I wrote about above are still going on. I have spent many an hour looking closely at what is going on and thought I had some insight but it appears to go bad randomly. I have recruited two other good testers to look too and they also find it random, but there are a couple of points that are repeatable ways to break assignments at a settlement. One thing that is breaking all assignments, and in all testers games is updating the mod mid save. If you update then you can endlessly add new guard posts or crops and the last assigned or sometimes first assigned settler will take on those assignments at least past 50 which was where I stopped.
After an update all crops and guard posts must be stored, rebuilt and, assigned fresh. That does not always work, the game fix is when you have reached the max a settler should take you build one more then override the assignment by assigning someone new, then things become stable.
Stable is not long lasting settlement assignments will break down. I have been leaving one crop and one guard post extra at all settlements as a test and some get magically assigned some don't. It sort of seems things go bad with script load, hard to say that on Xbox, but some indicators are things like how fast a trapped dog starts when you open the cage.
Turning the auto assignment switch off is also extremely random sometimes it works and sometimes even with the switch off settlers auto assign when they arrive. It does seem to have a relationship to existing vanilla guard posts, and crops. Things work better if all existing crops and posts are stored, which brings me to the castle where you can't store the guard mats. I think people are double assigning to those guard mats, I have more guard points than are available with what I have placed.
Another thing that breaks crops assignments is if the crops are in a picked state when the settlement is handed to you. If the crops were picked then the assignment system ignore the count of them but still assigns them and then stops when the new crops planted reach the assignment max.
Example Abernathy, crops all picked, crop assignments set at 6, return the locket and open the bench. There are enough crops for all three settlers to be at 6 and some extra. The mother and daughter both are assigned to crops the father is unassigned. Total crops assigned is 10 and when you add more crops it goes to 22 total before stopping. The father will assign to 6 guard and stop if assigned that way. There is a bug there some or all of the vanilla existing crops that don't auto assign will appear but can't be interacted with even in workshop mode. Those crops do become interact-able slowly a few at a time over many visits.
That is reproducable and has been exactly reproduced every time the test was run as a first settlement taken with the crops picked.

My gut says this has something to do with script load even if it is not the cause. Once more settlements are taken and the load comes up things are less predictable. Early on in a game assignments are more stable and can be broken and not broken using specific techniques, but those rules don't hold as the game proceeds. Settlers that can't be commanded also play a role in messing up assignments, but I can't find a connection other than to say they will more than likely take all crops planted if they auto assign, even with auto assign off. They also break the rule that is you manually assign a new settler to the last planted crop, the un-command-able settler takes the next one planted leaving just the single plant under control of the new settler.
We never even got to the point of turning on WS+, the point of the test, all of this was WSFW a lone as a baseline before installing WS+ to see if it had an effect on assignments.
 
Now that SS2 is out of the gate, I have a sliver of free time to look into this. Note that I am also doing updates for a couple of my mods (Raze My Settlement and Clean My Settlement) so it will be a few days before I can take a proper look.

Regarding the crops being non-interactable, or non-assignable, this is a known base game bug. It can happen at any settlement which starts with plants already there. (Wish that I’d known that before...wasted a month trying to find what mod was breaking vanilla plants in my games. /facepalm)


I will see what I can find regarding the over-assignment and shuffling assignments.
 
Now that SS2 is out of the gate, I have a sliver of free time to look into this. Note that I am also doing updates for a couple of my mods (Raze My Settlement and Clean My Settlement) so it will be a few days before I can take a proper look.

Regarding the crops being non-interactable, or non-assignable, this is a known base game bug. It can happen at any settlement which starts with plants already there. (Wish that I’d known that before...wasted a month trying to find what mod was breaking vanilla plants in my games. /facepalm)


I will see what I can find regarding the over-assignment and shuffling assignments.

Regarding the crops being non-interactable, or non-assignable, this is a known base game bug. It can happen at any settlement which starts with plants already there.
I am aware that the bug is vanilla, but I think you missed the point. The point I was trying to make clear but failed, is that it happens 100% of the time with WSFW installed and only occurred once without WSFW installed. I did stop when I made the fault happen vanilla. I just wanted to make sure that it could/would happen in those conditions. It becomes clear that some change in WSFW triggers this vanilla bug. This should give you a place to look. I am trying to give you good information so you have a starting place.
I will explain the test run and I did multiple tests to find a way to repeat the bug 100% of the time.
I started the game vanilla got to Abernathy and made a save before picking any crops. I tried picking the crops and then installing WSFW. I also installed WSFW before picking the crops. Then in both cases went and did the quest and returned before the crops could renew. I also did the same vanilla as a baseline where I picked the crops and did the quest and returned before the crop reset.
In the vanilla state on the 7 or 8th try I got the bug but the times before I did not get the bug. Also worth noting is it was not all of the un-assigned crops that were effected, and the stats of which settler was assigned to what crops and the number of crops was consistent but did change. For each of those tries I added different variables like also picking melons and selling them back or not selling them, slept in the spare bed. None of those things seemed to be relevant as the last try where the bug appeared was with nothing added and likely was much faster to complete because I had repeated so many times.
Next I installed WSFW then picked the crops and repeated some of the variables, but got the bug 100% of the time and the stats for the settlers were exactly the same each time. The total between the 2 females was always 10 total and all Tatos not assigned were not interact-able. The only change I noted was which crops were assigned to each, if I never picked and sold a melon to the daughter she was never assigned a melon to tend to. Idi not look to hard at those details but there is a relationship there, but it is outside the scope of what I was looking at.
The last test was picking the crops and then installing WSFW and the results of getting the bug were not 100% but were high,IIRC 5 out of 7 times and the assignments changed it was not always a total of 10 points, but the father was never assigned farming duties exact for a couple of times in the vanilla test.
I also repeated the two WSFW tests changing assignment values to 12 and more crops, but that had little effect and only on the picked crops then installation, but nothing I can put a point to.
As far as assignments I can generally keep them stable by doing specific things like removing all vanilla crops and not updating the mod mid save. That works 90% of the time until I get to a settlement with a un- commandable settler, but other times I have seen settlements go bad.
If you get an assignment issue it will affect both crops and guard duty but they don't seem to be connected as you can fix one and have assignments stick with out fixing the other. If I store all crops and replant/assign those assignments will stick but the guard duty will remain uncontrolled, but even making a new assignment in guard duty does not re-break the crops.
An easy way to look for broken assignments is to plant an extra Mutfruit that does not originally get assigned and the same for a guard station. Then when you return to a settlement they can quickly be checked.
Since I first reported this I have observed though many a new game and I still try and fix the first game that it happened to.
There are only two things that I can say for sure, update the mod mid save and assignments will be broken, the second is the vanilla bug triggering 100% of the time, even if the bug is vanilla triggering it 100% of the time is significant considering vanilla it does not trigger but a few times.
Just to get through the basics, I have good test procedures of proper cache clearing and deleting an save made after the save I am testing from etc.

Edit A very important point that I have missed disclosing is that I can never get the bug to happen in any setup if I don't pick the crops. I believe that I am at 100% of the time the crop is not picked the bug does not happen.
 
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First set of three tests tonight. Loadorder:
1604832293085.png
Testing process (Sanctuary only):
  • start from the mirror with all mods enabled
  • proceed through vault as normal until taking the Sanctuary workbench - save
  • lay down: 5x beds, 3x water pumps, 3x guard posts, a generator, a settlement beacon

Results so far:
TestSettlersAssigned To PlantsAssigned To Guard PostsChecked bIsGuardChecked WorkshopID
Test 1200NoYes
Test 1a201YesYes
Test 2301YesYes
Test 3*2 (eventually)01YesYes
Explanation:

Test 1a: I forgot to check the two settlers for bIsGuard in Test 1. Reloaded the save (prior to having attracted settlers) and checked when two settlers were attracted, one assigned themself as a guard - that one had the bIsGuard property.

Test 3*: The first settler attracted was a guard type. I then had to sleep for several days (about 5) to attract another settler - that one did not assign to plants, and was not a guard type.

Checked bIsGuard: Using "sv bisguard" brought up either true (for a guard-type settler) or false (for a non-guard-type settler). The settlers who did not assign to plants were not guard types.

Checked WorkshopID: Using "sv workshopid" on the workshop, the plants, and all of the settlers. All of them had the same WorkshopID.
 
Second set of tests early this morning. Loadorder:
1604833529687.png
Testing process (Sanctuary only):
  • start from the mirror with all mods enabled
  • proceed through vault as normal until taking the Sanctuary workbench - save
  • give myself a bunch of shipments
  • lay down: 5x beds, 3x water pumps, 3x guard posts, a generator, a settlement beacon
Results so far:
TestSettlersAssigned to PlantsAssigned to Guard PostsChecked bIsGuardChecked WorkshopID
Test 1*3 & 1 Brahmin1 (one unassigned)1YesYes
Test 2**21 (one unassigned)0YesYes
Explanation:

Test 1*: After the settlers arrived I harvested the existing crops and planted them (to give 2 gourds and 4 melons) - the settler who was assigned to farming was immediately assigned to them. All plants and settlers (and the brahmin) were assigned to the workshop.

Test 2**: After the settlers arrived I again harvested the existing crops existing crops and planted them - the settler who was assigned to farming was imediately assigned to them. All plants and settlers were assigned to the workshop. The settler who did not autoassign to the guard posts was not a guard type.

Something for @kinggath to start with - when he gets the chance to breathe. I'll continue tests another time, now I must sleep.
 
Next test with UFO4P:

TestSettlersAssigned to PlantsAssigned to Guard PostsChecked bIsGuardChecked WorkshopID
Test 3211YesYes
Explanation:

Test 3: This had 1 guard settler attracted first, immediately assigned to guard posts. After a week or so of resting a non-guard settler appeared and immediately assigned to plants. Harvested plants, planted, these were also immediately assigned.

Testing continues.
 
Near-vanilla test (F4SE and Private Profile Redirector only installed):
1604912212720.png
TestSettlersAssigned to PlantsAssigned to Guard PostsChecked bIsGuardChecked WorkshopID
Test A31 (1 unassigned)1YesYes
Test B211YesYes
Test C2 & Brahmin1 (1 unassigned)0YesYes
Explanation:

Test A: After the settlers arrived I harvested the existing crops and planted them (to give 2 gourds and 4 melons) - the settler who was assigned to farming was immediately assigned to them.

Test C: Some sleeping for the second settler and brahmin to show, the settler was not a guard type.

Testing over.
 
I'm uncertain what is going on in this thread - it started out as an alternate activation issue with WS+ and now looks like you guys are discussing assignment issues.

Can someone summarize what the current issue is for me and tell me how to replicate it?
 
Yeah it went all over the show. Sorry about that.

Basically a minimal game with WSFW doesn’t auto-assign settlers to vanilla crops, even though the settings say to and even though the crops appear to be properly set up and connected to the workbench. There may be some assignment shuffling going on as well, though I didn’t get that far in my testing - 9 restarts in 2 days has wiped me out.

I added vanilla guard posts to test if those auto-assign properly. They appear to when the summoned settler is a guard-type.

I know you’re busy. Mostly I wanted to put it up here for when you have some free time and to let Sailor know that yeah there appears to be a problem - even if I’ve not tested as far as he has.
 
I'm uncertain what is going on in this thread - it started out as an alternate activation issue with WS+ and now looks like you guys are discussing assignment issues.

Can someone summarize what the current issue is for me and tell me how to replicate it?
Originally when this issue came up both WS+ and WSFW were updated at the same time and the new feature with activation buttons was not working so was assumed to be the issue. Further testing without WS+ has proven that it issue lies in WSFW. On a clean start the game seems to work on Xbox, but an update to the mod mid save definitely breaks assignment caps at minimum. Settlers will not pay attention to the cap. That said sometimes you must remove all existing plants and replant to get the settlers to follow the caps. That part seems to be random I have not found a specific key to what causes that.
All of that is manageable by either not updating mid save or simple by removing all crops or defenses and reassigning. Although auto assign seems to be funny during that time, but I have not found a key.
The major issue is the settlers that can't be commanded and that is where I am testing now. This might be the best first test to get an overall view, but first a little side note that I just noticed. Junkyard dogs that have been trapped, if you allow them to settle in and find a doghouse will not physically move when moved in build mode their assignment moves with their stats to the new settlement but they stay where they are. This does not effect dogmeat or CC dogs.
Back to the main issue with non command-able settlers. A good place to test is at Somerville where there are 2 kids.
There are 15 corn plants there, and unfortunately I had settlers capped at 12 points for crops when I got there. I saved before I reported success and played this a few ways.
None worked out as they should but I will just describe one attempt with the 12 setting. When the settlement was mine the girl was the only assigned settler and the food point total was 7. As I planted more crops she keep auto assigning all and I got to 30, yet the brother never picked up one, he was still unassigned. I then used mats and some other mod items to see if different things could trigger him to action. Nothing worked, although there was a significant delay the daughter took control of all those items.
So next I stored all crops but one to avoid a common vanilla bug where taking the crops to 0 for a non command-able will make them never auto assign again. Starting with one crop and planted got the same results, she took all crops over the cap and the son never assigned. Next was to go to 0 for the daughter and then replant, as expected the daughter did not assign but the son did, his behavior was the same as his sisters was where he took all crops planted, I stopped at 30 or so. I have continued in other tests and there seems to be no cap so now I just go to/over the max cap that can be set by WSFW. I am yet to test this part on a save that was not updated, but someone else has and said they got similar results.

If you update the mod mid save it is like existing plants are ignored, they seem to cap out with their current load plus the cap. So if they had 12 they will now take 12 more then cap. Generally, sometimes they continue on the same as a non command-able settler, but those are my next set of tests a soon as I find one.. I have saved and not reset two settlements since I last updated that I know have the assignment bug, but on one I had to repair the guards so I have two food and one guard bugged out that I can test.
Here are some simple shots the first at Abernathy where there is one guard not repaired and 3 farmer, not repaired, all are set to 12 points of assignment.
Fallout 4 2020-11-08 15-48-00.png
There are 3 settlers all with 12 so 36 for the food total is as it should be. Now I will add one plant that will show a 1 point gain and the settler that was last assigned in the settlement will take it.Fallout 4 2020-11-08 15-48-37.jpg
The same holds true for the single guard at this location he has 12 points assined and the other points are from other turrets and dogs which seem to be un effected by this bug.
Fallout 4 2020-11-08 15-50-00.jpg
Now if I add one more post the total jumps by 2.
Fallout 4 2020-11-08 15-51-13.jpg
By pointing at him you can see he took the .assignment Just a reminder this happens seemingly 100% after an update but is manageable and repairable.
I fixed this in Sanctuary after the update and placing a guard post leaves the post unassigned.
Fallout 4 2020-11-08 16-05-21.jpg
The defense was at 62 before I built that and remained 10 minutes later but I left it for a see in the future.
 
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