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SS2 on Hard is crazy hard

MadGax

MadGax

Well-Known Member
Messages
306
Maybe its just me, but I am running SS2 with Involvement set to Full, All costs to ON, and resources complexity set to Components.
And man I cannot keep up with 15 people at Sanctuary, 13 at RR, 13 at Abernathy Farms, 8 at Tenpines and 10 at Sunshine.

Oil, Copper and Ceramic are kicking my ass.
At level 25 I finally got them all connected on Caravan services at least.
 
It has been Cork of all things for me in my attempts at Maximum Difficulty after the numbers-balance patch. The "cost per day" on Training plots seems a bit high, especially since you want to get those going asap to actually make any difference.
 
MadGax said:
Maybe its just me, but I am running SS2 with Involvement set to Full, All costs to ON, and resources complexity set to Components.
And man I cannot keep up with 15 people at Sanctuary, 13 at RR, 13 at Abernathy Farms, 8 at Tenpines and 10 at Sunshine.

Oil, Copper and Ceramic are kicking my ass.
At level 25 I finally got them all connected on Caravan services at least.
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Honestly 15 people at sanctuary, 13 at red rocket and 13 at abernathy... forget about how hard the game is and go take a look at the triangle of death before it's too late!
 
Irealys said:
Honestly 15 people at sanctuary, 13 at red rocket and 13 at abernathy... forget about how hard the game is and go take a look at the triangle of death before it's too late!
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Ya, I have had a few crashes here in that in the triangle, so I rolled back to 14, 14 and 12 and removed some factory machinery and things have gotten better.
 
Ive found turning off non plot costs and using only one upkeep (I usually use the plot plan) helps. Having all of it on is indeed way too expensive.
 
I am definitely thankful for there being as many options as there are for customizing how the mod plays, even if I do believe it errs a bit too far towards the difficult end of the spectrum, especially since that is mostly 'front loaded' difficulty at a point in the overall game where you cant afford it. There was that one mad lad that wanted an even HARDER mode, though...
 
Through probably a hundred restarts at this point, I think I've gotten the hang of the Virtual Economy at the level I prefer to build at. A niggling thought has stuck with me the whole time that I couldn't quite put into words until you said it as "two economies", and that nailed it down.

To me, it feels like Settlements are now even more disconnected from the rest of the game at the mechanics level, rather than more attached - the opposite effect that the Jake Storyline has in a 'fluff' sense. So it creates this odd feeling of 'mismatch'.
I guess I will wait and see what Chapter 2 brings in that regard (I have some suspicions) before I cast full judgment though.
 
Here is something I personally think is based on assumptions you have. Because I don't see it as disconnecting from the main game. It's basically what the economy of the town is doing. Not YOUR economy, what EVERYBODY ELSE is working on. When playing an RPG I do roleplay the character and I never was under the impression I was supposed to be personally gaining from the SS systems. I'm putting down what helps me get what I want (I do want to rebuild the wasteland) so I'm not expecting on top of it to be abusing the situation for my benefit. I want SOME recognition, benefit and advantages which the mod gives me. Could it be more? Well for starters I made a thread about it but the municipal building to get taxes should be a LOT easier to unlock in my opinion. This would solve mostly my issues personally in terms of gains.

What I'm really having a hard time is with the inability to put an emphasis on some materials you may be in bigger need at that time. Especially when we get full. This is where I feel VERY MUCH like this is not part of the game anymore. It's a system that doesn't allow me any input and that I have to accept how it works no matter how illogical it would be. Easy example: your town is waiting for concrete to finish three buildings? Youd put everything else on hold until you get that, you wouldn't fill it until you cannot gather concrete anymore. But because there is really no way of interacting AT ALL it now feel not like it's the economy of the town I'm the mayor of but a different system of limitations that the settlers and me are just accepting without real logic to it. I know its complicated to make changes but if this part could be fixed, I would personally have a lot less issues iwth disconnect.

Obviously, this is only my personal take, I respect everyone else's different views too.
 
Yeah I know full well that my obsession with the mechanical side of things isn't even where the mod's direction seems to be focused, and that not many people seem to agree. To be completely honest, if it weren't for some of the mechanical improvements SS2 brought, I'd have long since gone back to SS1.

It's just that it feels to me like there's Fallout 4, and then there's settlement-building, and they're two separate games that just happen to be running on the same engine, with no real interaction between the two.
Now to be fair I haven't even built a Communications Plot in literal months, and that's where a lot of the Settlements->Gameworld interaction takes place, but I can't stand how there's no way to stop them from recruiting more people since the options that claim to change that don't seem to actually work. And by the time those unlock, I dont even NEED Mk1 Beacons for the resources anyway.
 
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On further reflection, even the Jake Questline doesnt really help my feelings on the 'disconnect' front. The few people lately that asked about doing the questline without settlements got me thinking - apart from the couple of quests with explicit objectives for it, they are basically irrelevant to the questline as a whole. Not helping is a couple of points that what the story says isnt actually mechanically represented - for example, Jake tells you that you will only be able to build the other four plot types "not too far away" from The Comm Hub, which is either outright wrong or the "range" still reaches all the way to Maine. (plus, that thing isnt even still there after ch1 ends, which causes no problems whatsoever- you even get Comms Plots, which the story says run through the Hub, AFTER it is gone)
 
And then you unlock the Salvage Beacons after Jake is gone... (I want Jake to hand them to me:no:)
 
I meam I get it from a technical sense - just imagine the complaints if the buildings were all disabled and useless the instant you finish ch1 - but why even have some of those lines then?
 
yaugieLC said:
On further reflection, even the Jake Questline doesnt really help my feelings on the 'disconnect' front. The few people lately that asked about doing the questline without settlements got me thinking - apart from the couple of quests with explicit objectives for it, they are basically irrelevant to the questline as a whole. Not helping is a couple of points that what the story says isnt actually mechanically represented - for example, Jake tells you that you will only be able to build the other four plot types "not too far away" from The Comm Hub, which is either outright wrong or the "range" still reaches all the way to Maine. (plus, that thing isnt even still there after ch1 ends, which causes no problems whatsoever- you even get Comms Plots, which the story says run through the Hub, AFTER it is gone)
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Yes. @yaugieLC nails it. :good

Where settlement development is more important is the extra side quests with all the new recruitable NPC's.

That part "the settlers and side quests" in the CH1 content depends on vanilla game choices and progression and settlement development.

Given your choices in each playthrough, you will likely get acquainted with different NPCs with their own unique side quests and contributions to your settlements.
 
RayBo said:
Yes. @yaugieLC nails it. :good

Where settlement development is more important is the extra side quests with all the new recruitable NPC's.

That part "the settlers and side quests" in the CH1 content depends on vanilla game choices and progression and settlement development.

Given your choices in each playthrough, you will likely get acquainted with different NPCs with their own unique side quests and contributions to your settlements.
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I guess I just have this feeling of "what is even the point of all that work", unless Chapter 2 reveals it is where all the actual rewards both fluff and crunch wise are. (which it looks to me like it might)
I shouldnt have even opened my stupid mouth on this subject, I know nobody really shares these feelings.
 
yaugieLC said:
I guess I just have this feeling of "what is even the point of all that work", unless Chapter 2 reveals it is where all the actual rewards both fluff and crunch wise are. (which it looks to me like it might)
I shouldnt have even opened my stupid mouth on this subject, I know nobody really shares these feelings.
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IDK, "I shouldnt have even opened my stupid mouth on this subject, I know nobody really shares these feelings." I was just commenting on the fact that a player can focus on just the story if they want after the intro, or go off and use the tape and build away, or play for a huge number of hours and unlock all the side quests and NPC's.
Which was what I kind of thought was where you were going? I might have missed the point of the conversation? hahahaha, normal for me :crazy :punish

If there is one thing I have learned is that KG does have a master plan.
I think he has stated that there is 3CH to this story.
That story and all the interactions and mechanics are for the most part locked inside his head.
All I know is each rendition in the evolution of SS has always held something for me.
That "something" doesn't have to be everything, and sometimes it isn't, but he always has something.
In the end that "something" always has me coming back and is more than I could have ever hoped for.
Not bad for content I could have never envisioned myself nor have paid for from any company. His free content alone is responsible for 4000hours of my 6000+ hours in this game.
I'll take what he is giving us, my own imagination can take care of the rest. That to me is the best part of any game.
Giving the player the tools to expand on their own imagination. SS does that for me like no other game I have ever played. :friends
 
I totally agree with you @yaugieLC on the disconnect.

I've found the quest line to be really well done, way better than almost everything else out there for FO4.
I've found the settlements to be more engaging (mentally challenging) than they were in SS1.

However these two parts, quest and settlement, really have very little that ties them together (with the notable exception of plots being quest locked).
And the quest locks take way too long to open up, talking just the number of FO4 days that are required for plots to level up and then unlock the next tier.

I've done about 10 full Chap 1 plays now (that did not uses any of the cheats)... In all of those runs combined, I've never unlocked most of the higher end plots... about the time you hit level 60 the game gets to easy mode, and once Nate/Nora is level 80 to 100 there is really nothing left to do that has any kind of challenge in FO4. But still not enough time has passed for the plots to fully open.

The other issue I've felt on a disconnect level is the special SS2 npc's. Consider this, SS2 changes all of the SPECIAL stats of the two ladies that are running Oberland BY THEMSELVES to 1 or 2.... then any of the unique SS2 settlers would be welcomed with open arms at any settlement in the wastes, just based on there stats and skills. They do not need Nate/Nora to help them... the average settlers needs the help, but I always feel like SS2 really only wants to help the elite settlers.
 
Revived said:
I've done about 10 full Chap 1 plays now (that did not uses any of the cheats)... In all of those runs combined, I've never unlocked most of the higher end plots...
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Ok, guys help me out?

So, is the main point: It takes too long to unlock the higher tier plots?

I am kind of trying to capture clear bullet points that could make the mod better?

The recreational plots are kind of there to help player modify other settler stats to make them more special?
 
My main point is this: what the story of the mod SAYS it is doing, runs contrary to what the mechanics of the mod actually DO, at least in my opinion. The majority of the mechanics and any substantial reward taking so long to all be achieved are all part of that.
It legitimately feels (to me) like The Jake Story is a totally separate quest mod that someone haphazardly edited a few mentions of settlements into so they could trick more people into playing it, rather than a questline ABOUT settlements. And now fixing/adding to that questline takes dev time priority over the settlement stuff, which is the only reason I downloaded this in the first place.
 
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